Makes sense. Corraborates well with what I’ve heard about this from other friends.
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16 Responses to “Jeyamohan on Indian students attack”
I see it in todays youngsters that come here to the US on H1B visas.
Gone are the days, when people like me came here, and respected the way of life here and try to assimate into the american way of living.
Kids who come here now - Have a superiority complex IMHO. They think that America depends on India for its services and act as though they are all Einsteins and Newtons!! looking down on Americans as idiots..who can’t work !!
I’ve noticed this trend in companies that employ a lot of Desi companies for consultants.
Nobody cares for etiquette. They talk in their own language, all over, sit and chit chat in break rooms, and live the rooms so dirty thinking they’ll have servants like the IT companies like India.
Actually - I am very ashamed the way the kids these days behave.!!
Add to that the situation in the USA where thousands of people have lost their jobs due to outsourcing. I only hope and pray things don’t go south here.
BTW - The article by Jeyamohan and the ending was very nice !!
Terrific Post by JeyaMohan - thanks for linking this. North Indian Hubris directa experience pannavangulukku dhaan puriyum - One full year I got caught with these guys on a UK project several years ago. Manusha jenmangaley kidayadhu. I think JM is right on the money on so many counts. The inferiority complex thing is very real - these guys were very upset that I was brought into the project and asked me ‘When is the next Venkat joining the project ?” (they were using Venkat as a generic south indian name). These guys were utterly terrified by Southies being allowed on the project. They used to make fun of a Telugu guy about his dark complexion - talk about racism, eh ?. On New Year’s eve we were travelling by train and these guys were drunk and started heckling some of the locals (white guys) and harassing them. Those guys put up with it rather cheerfully. I quit that project after a year and came back even though I was doing very well moneywise.
A few years back peculiar circumstances found me seated with some upper class folks in a restaurant in Bangalore. One of the guys was from one of the famous business families of Bangalore. This Kannada guy summed it up best when he said “North and South India are two different countries” - even the northies sitting around the table agreed.
//ஒரு வட இந்தியப் பணக்காரன் புத்தம் புது ஊரில் இறங்கி அங்கே நிற்கும் ஒரு ஏழையை அடே போட்டுக் கூப்பிட்டு தனக்கு ஒரு வேலையை ஏவ முடியும்.//
And this is extremely clear when you see them dealing with shopkeepers.
A few years back I was in Toronto for a few months and used to frequent a Lebanese felafel shop. Middle-Eastern folks have the most friendly approach I have seen. I have found Caucasian geniality largely a bit artificial. But middle-east folks have an infectious geniality. The family who ran the shop were especially genial.
“What will you have my friend” is how they speak to their customers.Whenever some North Indies folks enter the place and talk brunt and brash to that shopkeeper. Made me cringe every time.
But JM is right in saying this hubris is expanding all over NI in the next generation. It makes me feel old to talk about ‘generation’ but the distinct difference in the lack of common courtesy is so obvious. It would be too much of armchair sociology to try and blame it all on post liberalization changes. But konjam yOsichA yEdhO vishayam irukkura maadhiri irukku.
PK, Jeyamohan’s article is spot on for the most part. I haven’t lived or been to north except a Bombay trip when in college with the whole class. But my father has been there, and he told me about how on trains, they would simply occupy your rightful seat/berth and would simply ignore you and your requests.
I know the kind of individuals JM talks about and I have worked with a few of them in the past. Patronizing is the word that comes to mind. There are a plenty of exceptions as well. I think it cannot be helped as we Indians are not a homogeneous population, and culture, respect for law and common sense etc is more prevalent in south.
However, I did not like the stereotyping of the girl in airplane(”இந்த இளவரசி யார்? கிரானைட் அல்லது இறால் ஏற்றுமதி செய்யும் ஒரு ஆசாமியின் மகளாக இருப்பாள்”). She could be very well a daughter of a bank manager or a central government employee. I was raised by a capitalist father, who never worked for anyone else in his entire life, started with seed money from friends and family, and I turned out just fine.
In my experience, I’ve seen just as much disgusting behavior by the nouveau riche types as much as the landowner (pannaiyaar or mirasudhaar) types that JM mentions.
On a global level, I once saw an Arab dude getting all self righteous, fight the employees in a car rental office with all kind of nasty words, in front of another family with kids and myself, for supposedly giving him a bad car; this was a year or so after 9-11. My observation was that he tried to weasel his way out of paying for the rental.
It’s my pet( and perhaps incorrect) theory that we Indians are not equipped habitually to live in urban settings…the more sophisticated, the more complex the settings the more we make a mess of it and ourselves…
Be it Oz or US..i suppose its the same.. plus the euphoria caused by outsourcing…
having said that if the market picks up in the next year or two in India… all will be forgotten and things will be back to square one again…
I have not had such bad experiences with northies..primarily because i’ve been in TN for all my professional life…
But i’ve hard these things from too many people to doubt this
I agree. Years back I have travelled on TN. An older tamil lady myself and a group of Delhi College of Engineering students and a group of girls from some Womens boarding school in North India (I heard one girl talking and one of the girls dad was Digjam suitings owner) all were in one big compartment. The DCE guys kept smoking and they got drunk in the night, according to me misbehaved but according to the gals..had a good time with them, shouted at the older south indian lady who asked them to switch the lights off and cut the noise, shouted at me for saying Dont smoke in AC. And finally added : This is TN train but still it is going in North India..You cant do a thing we have bribed the TT . India still has so many so called educated people like those hyper college students, elderly nasty people like that TT and rich girls with they can do whatever they want wherever they want attitude. Why should we blame some other countrymen.
Infact contrary to this I wanted to get down at my stop in ahmedabad in navjeevan express and a younger very responsible TT made sure I got down safely in Akola in the middle of the night at 2.00 When it was pouring outside.
I firnly believe that “Unless you keep the weeds off even the best crop will not be able to grow! - But how?”
dagalti:
“I have found Caucasian geniality largely a bit artificial.”
True, but I think it’s more of a North American thing, In Europe it can get frosty for reasons that have nothing to do with the weather.
prabhukarthik:
That mention of Navjeevan express reminded me of another incident. Once, I was standing at the Ahmedabad railway station in the reservation queue for more than an hour (prob. two hours). The queue was moving like Molasses and everyone was on the edge. I finally got into third pojisun and suddenly a sardarji, another another area pombalai, and a couple of others suddenly started accusing me of having jumped the queue. They then proceeded to push me out of the queue. Adhuvum this is not even in real North India.
Gujjus though they would be offended at being called North Indians are very accepting of Hindi and all that. Once a conducive atmosphere has been created for Hindi , then you create fertile ground for ‘North Indianism’ .
June 27th, 2009 at 5:45 pm
Its a very good article by Jeyamohan. But who in Melbourne / Sydney is ready to accept this?
June 27th, 2009 at 11:15 pm
PK,
I am sorry - But I have to voice this.
I see it in todays youngsters that come here to the US on H1B visas.
Gone are the days, when people like me came here, and respected the way of life here and try to assimate into the american way of living.
Kids who come here now - Have a superiority complex IMHO. They think that America depends on India for its services and act as though they are all Einsteins and Newtons!! looking down on Americans as idiots..who can’t work !!
I’ve noticed this trend in companies that employ a lot of Desi companies for consultants.
Nobody cares for etiquette. They talk in their own language, all over, sit and chit chat in break rooms, and live the rooms so dirty thinking they’ll have servants like the IT companies like India.
Actually - I am very ashamed the way the kids these days behave.!!
Add to that the situation in the USA where thousands of people have lost their jobs due to outsourcing. I only hope and pray things don’t go south here.
BTW - The article by Jeyamohan and the ending was very nice !!
Thank you.
June 28th, 2009 at 12:35 am
Terrific Post by JeyaMohan - thanks for linking this. North Indian Hubris directa experience pannavangulukku dhaan puriyum - One full year I got caught with these guys on a UK project several years ago. Manusha jenmangaley kidayadhu. I think JM is right on the money on so many counts. The inferiority complex thing is very real - these guys were very upset that I was brought into the project and asked me ‘When is the next Venkat joining the project ?” (they were using Venkat as a generic south indian name). These guys were utterly terrified by Southies being allowed on the project. They used to make fun of a Telugu guy about his dark complexion - talk about racism, eh ?. On New Year’s eve we were travelling by train and these guys were drunk and started heckling some of the locals (white guys) and harassing them. Those guys put up with it rather cheerfully. I quit that project after a year and came back even though I was doing very well moneywise.
A few years back peculiar circumstances found me seated with some upper class folks in a restaurant in Bangalore. One of the guys was from one of the famous business families of Bangalore. This Kannada guy summed it up best when he said “North and South India are two different countries” - even the northies sitting around the table agreed.
And this Indians are running America and Americans are all stupid thing has crossed all limits. You might have read the recent claim by the HCL CEO that American graduates are unemployable - http://www.informationweek.com/blog/main/archives/2009/06/top_indian_ceo.html;jsessionid=D2BJAXEVTPLJIQSNDLRSKH0CJUNN2JVN .
June 28th, 2009 at 1:07 pm
JM spot-on again.
//ஒரு வட இந்தியப் பணக்காரன் புத்தம் புது ஊரில் இறங்கி அங்கே நிற்கும் ஒரு ஏழையை அடே போட்டுக் கூப்பிட்டு தனக்கு ஒரு வேலையை ஏவ முடியும்.//
And this is extremely clear when you see them dealing with shopkeepers.
A few years back I was in Toronto for a few months and used to frequent a Lebanese felafel shop. Middle-Eastern folks have the most friendly approach I have seen. I have found Caucasian geniality largely a bit artificial. But middle-east folks have an infectious geniality. The family who ran the shop were especially genial.
“What will you have my friend” is how they speak to their customers.Whenever some North Indies folks enter the place and talk brunt and brash to that shopkeeper. Made me cringe every time.
But JM is right in saying this hubris is expanding all over NI in the next generation. It makes me feel old to talk about ‘generation’ but the distinct difference in the lack of common courtesy is so obvious. It would be too much of armchair sociology to try and blame it all on post liberalization changes. But konjam yOsichA yEdhO vishayam irukkura maadhiri irukku.
Indha “positive aggression” -ngra expression-ai kaNdupidichavanai naan romba naaLA thEdikkittu irukkEn.
June 28th, 2009 at 8:09 pm
PK, Jeyamohan’s article is spot on for the most part. I haven’t lived or been to north except a Bombay trip when in college with the whole class. But my father has been there, and he told me about how on trains, they would simply occupy your rightful seat/berth and would simply ignore you and your requests.
I know the kind of individuals JM talks about and I have worked with a few of them in the past. Patronizing is the word that comes to mind. There are a plenty of exceptions as well. I think it cannot be helped as we Indians are not a homogeneous population, and culture, respect for law and common sense etc is more prevalent in south.
However, I did not like the stereotyping of the girl in airplane(”இந்த இளவரசி யார்? கிரானைட் அல்லது இறால் ஏற்றுமதி செய்யும் ஒரு ஆசாமியின் மகளாக இருப்பாள்”). She could be very well a daughter of a bank manager or a central government employee. I was raised by a capitalist father, who never worked for anyone else in his entire life, started with seed money from friends and family, and I turned out just fine.
In my experience, I’ve seen just as much disgusting behavior by the nouveau riche types as much as the landowner (pannaiyaar or mirasudhaar) types that JM mentions.
On a global level, I once saw an Arab dude getting all self righteous, fight the employees in a car rental office with all kind of nasty words, in front of another family with kids and myself, for supposedly giving him a bad car; this was a year or so after 9-11. My observation was that he tried to weasel his way out of paying for the rental.
I want to call your attention to this article in IE by an Australian professor.
http://www.indianexpress.com/news/dear-parents-and-students/470286/
Apologies for this very long comment. I hope it made sense.
June 29th, 2009 at 9:17 am
Deepak
Thanks da.. unkitte pesinadhu, it struck me as spot on immediately on reading this article by JM..
June 29th, 2009 at 11:54 pm
nalla article pk..chance illa
June 30th, 2009 at 10:39 am
NV sir
It’s my pet( and perhaps incorrect) theory that we Indians are not equipped habitually to live in urban settings…the more sophisticated, the more complex the settings the more we make a mess of it and ourselves…
Be it Oz or US..i suppose its the same.. plus the euphoria caused by outsourcing…
having said that if the market picks up in the next year or two in India… all will be forgotten and things will be back to square one again…
June 30th, 2009 at 10:40 am
BNB
I have not had such bad experiences with northies..primarily because i’ve been in TN for all my professional life…
But i’ve hard these things from too many people to doubt this
June 30th, 2009 at 10:41 am
dagalti,
June 30th, 2009 at 10:43 am
Ram,
I’ve heard tales about the attoozhiyams done by ‘Kuruvis’ on the chennai-Singapore-malaysia route in IA flights… avanga ellam panakaarangala enna…
Mothathula…valarpu, habits, cullture…
June 30th, 2009 at 10:48 am
priya
nandri!
June 30th, 2009 at 8:34 pm
I agree. Years back I have travelled on TN. An older tamil lady myself and a group of Delhi College of Engineering students and a group of girls from some Womens boarding school in North India (I heard one girl talking and one of the girls dad was Digjam suitings owner) all were in one big compartment. The DCE guys kept smoking and they got drunk in the night, according to me misbehaved but according to the gals..had a good time with them, shouted at the older south indian lady who asked them to switch the lights off and cut the noise, shouted at me for saying Dont smoke in AC. And finally added : This is TN train but still it is going in North India..You cant do a thing we have bribed the TT . India still has so many so called educated people like those hyper college students, elderly nasty people like that TT and rich girls with they can do whatever they want wherever they want attitude. Why should we blame some other countrymen.
Infact contrary to this I wanted to get down at my stop in ahmedabad in navjeevan express and a younger very responsible TT made sure I got down safely in Akola in the middle of the night at 2.00 When it was pouring outside.
I firnly believe that “Unless you keep the weeds off even the best crop will not be able to grow! - But how?”
June 30th, 2009 at 8:50 pm
dagalti:
“I have found Caucasian geniality largely a bit artificial.”
True, but I think it’s more of a North American thing, In Europe it can get frosty for reasons that have nothing to do with the weather.
prabhukarthik:
That mention of Navjeevan express reminded me of another incident. Once, I was standing at the Ahmedabad railway station in the reservation queue for more than an hour (prob. two hours). The queue was moving like Molasses and everyone was on the edge. I finally got into third pojisun and suddenly a sardarji, another another area pombalai, and a couple of others suddenly started accusing me of having jumped the queue. They then proceeded to push me out of the queue. Adhuvum this is not even in real North India.
Gujjus though they would be offended at being called North Indians are very accepting of Hindi and all that. Once a conducive atmosphere has been created for Hindi , then you create fertile ground for ‘North Indianism’ .
July 4th, 2009 at 3:38 am
priyums
I think we’ve already discussed that particular incident sometime back
July 4th, 2009 at 3:39 am
BNB
North indianism - time for an entry in wiki i guess (if its not avlble now)